Uwo munsi Perezida Kagame yashimiye Abadepite barangije inshingano, ababwira ko “Gusesa Inteko ntabwo bivuze kubagaya, ni igihe tugezemo cy’intera yindi, cy’ibindi tugomba kujyamo, ubwo ngira ngo benshi muzagaruka niba atari mwese, ariko uyu munsi byari ibyo kubashimira no kubabwira ngo ni ah’ubutaha.”

Ku wa Gatatu tariki ya 17 Nyakanga 2024, IGIHE yagiranye ikiganiro cyihariye n’uwari Perezida w’Umutwe w’Abadepite, Mukabalisa Donatille.

Mu 2013 nibwo Mukabalisa Donatille wari umaze imyaka igera ku 10 mu Nteko Ishinga amategeko y’u Rwanda yatorewe kuyiyobora, ibintu byamuhaye kugira inararibonye ku nshingano zayo zirebana no gutegura no gutora amategeko ndetse no kugenzura ibikorwa bya Guverinoma.

Muri iki kiganiro yagarutse ku musaruro wa manda ishize y’Inteko Ishinga Amategeko, Umutwe wAbadepite, anitsa mu mukoro ku bashya bazinjiramo.

IGIHE: Nk’umuntu wari umaze igihe ayoboye, ni gute mubona umusaruro w’Inteko Ishinga Amategeko, Umutwe w’Abadepite?

Mukabalisa Donatille: Navuga ko umusaruro wa manda ishize uri ku rugero twebwe twishimiye nk’abari bayirimo kuko twakoze ibishoboka byose kugira ngo inshingano zacu tuzikore neza, dukora ibishoboka byose kugira ngo dutore amategeko abereye Abanyarwanda, twagiye tunakurikirana nyuma y’igihe runaka ko ayo mategeko agenda ashyirwa mu bikorwa uko bikwiye, kandi arimo asubiza ibibazo byatumye ashyirwaho.

Twakoze inshingano zacu zo kugenzura ibikorwa bya Guverinoma kugira ngo turebe niba Gahunda ya Guverinoma y’imyaka irindwi [NST1] yari irimo ishyirwa mu bikorwa nk’uko bikwiye, tukareba niba ibipimo twiyemeje nk’Abanyarwanda birimo bibasha kugerwaho kandi mu gihe twabaga twariyemeje nk’Abanyarwanda.

Tukaba rero twishimira ko muri izo gahunda, ubwo bufatanye n’izindi nzego hari ibyakozwe kandi byageze ku gipimo twishimira, n’ubwo hari ibitarageze ku gipimo twari twihaye nk’Abanyarwanda ariko bifite impamvu yabyo.

Ngira ngo hari byinshi twagiye tunyuramo bisa nkaho bitudindiza nka Covid-19, ariko ibyo ntago byaduhagaritse twarakomeje dukora mu bushobozi twari dufite, twishimira ndetse ko n’ikorabuhanga ryari ryaratejwe imbere ryaradufashije muri ibyo bihe mu buryo butangaje.

Imirimo y’Inteko Ishinga Amategeko ntiyahagaze, wenda icyahagaze gato ni ukwegera abaturage ngo tugirane inama imbona nkubone, ariko nyuma icyo kibazo cyaje gukemuka, turakomeza twegera n’abaturage kugira ngo twumve ibibazo byabo dufatanye n’izindi nzego kugira ngo bishakirwe ibisubizo.

Twabashije kugera aho ibikorwa bibera, imishinga itandukanye kugira ngo turebe uburyo irimo gushyirwa mu bikorwa mu murongo rusange w’ingendo z’abadepite cyangwa iz’ama komosiyo atandukanye bitewe n’inshingano za buri imwe.

Twumva hari ibikorwa byinshi twakoze kandi twishimira byanafashije igihugu cyacu kugira ngo kibashe kugera ku byiza cyagezeho, ariko birumvikana urugendo ruracyahari kandi n’abazakurikira muri iyi manda bafite umusingi ukomeye bazatangiriraho, kandi bafite ibikorwa bazakomeza.

Ngira ngo hari n’ibibazo by’abaturage mwagiye mwumva bageza ku bagize Inteko Ishinga Amategeko, mwagiye mwumva mu nteko rusange hari za raporo z’ama komisiyo yabaga yasuzumye ibibazo by’abaturage kandi inzego bireba zikabishakira ibisubizo.

Twumva ko inshingano twazikoze neza kandi turizera neza ko zatanze umusaruro wari witezwe kandi tukaba dushimira n’abari batugiriye icyizere icyo gihe bakadutora kandi n’ubu dushimira abaturage bagiriye icyizere abazahagararira mu Nteko bazakomereza ku byo twubatse noneho bikarushaho kuba byiza.

Bamwe mu baturage bagiye banenga Abadepite kutabakorera ubuvugizi ku bibazo bimwe na bimwe bikomeye. Ibyo mubona biterwa n’iki?

Abanenga ntiwababuza kunenga ariko ntanubwo wanavuga ngo Abantu babaho nta bibazo. Ariko icya ngombwa ni ubushake bwo kubikemura, icya ngombwa ni sisitemu iba iriho iba ihangayikishijwe n’uko buri muturage ikibazo yaba afite gikemuka.

Ibyo bibazo rero byagiye bishakirwa ibisubizo, nubwo bitakemuka ako kanya mu gihe runaka abantu babyifuza, ariko biba biri mu nzira nziza yo gukemuka, kandi twizera neza ko niba hari n’ibigihari bizakemuka kubera ko ibintu byose aba ari urugendo.

Ntabwo ushobora kubyuka mu gitondo ngo ibibazo urahita ubikemura niba cyanavutse, kandi ntushobora kubaho muri sosiyete ibaho itagira ibibazo.

Icya ngombwa ni ubushake n’imbaraga abantu bashyiramo kugira ngo ikibazo kigaragare gishakirwe igisubizo kandi ubuyobozi buriho kugira ngo bushake igisubizo, sisitemu yacu ishyira umuturage n’inyungu ze ku isonga.

Ibyo rero nibyo bya ngombwa cyane, ntabwo wabyuka mu gitondo ubone ngo Isi ibaye paradizo nta kibazo kirimo, ibintu byose ni urugendo.

Mubona hakorwa iki mu gushakira umuti ibibazo by’abanenga imikorere y’Inteko Ishinga Amategeko?

Hari abanenga nibyo ariko hari n’abashima benshi, kuko iyo Inteko Ishinga Amategeko n’abayigize bakoze ingendo rusange kugira ngo baganire n’abaturage ku bibazo bafite barebe n’uko gahunda zigamije kubateza imbere zishyirwa mu bikorwa.

Nabo erega bagomba kugira uruhare bagira muri izo gahunda zigamije kubateza imbere, nk’uko Perezida wa Repubulika Paul Kagame yigeze kubigarukaho ati “Ibyo tugeraho buri wese aba yabigizemo uruhare.”

Nk’ababa bahagarariye rero abaturage, kuba Inteko yaragiye ikora ingendo rusange nibura kabiri mu mwaka, tudashyizemo iz’ama komisiyo atandukanye, kugira ngo bagere mu mirenge no mu tugari twose bareba ibikorwa bitandukanye by’iterambere, imishinga n’ibikorwa byagenewe ingengo y’imari uburyo biri gushyirwa mu bikorwa, twibwira ko hari benshi bagiye babishima. Ibyo rero twe turavuga ko iyo tubona benshi bashima natwe biradushimisha.

Ibibazo byinshi byagiye bibonerwa ibisubizo ndetse navuga ko ari hafi ya byose, wenda ibitaragiye bibonerwa ibisubizo bizagenda biboneka. Hari na za raporo twasize tutarabona muri iyi manda ishize, ubwo abandi bazaziheraho kandi bazisuzume.

Ukurikije imikorere y’Inteko Ishinga Amategeko, ni ibiki ubona byavugururwa kugira ngo abaturage barusheho kuyigirira icyizere?

Mu iby’ukuri ibyagombaga kuvugururwa byaravuguruwe, dutangira iyi manda dusoje, hari byinshi twagiye tureba uko imikorere yarushaho kuba myiza. Ibyo rero byavuguruwe mu mategeko.

Hari itegeko ngenga rigena imikorere y’umutwe w’abadepite ndetse n’itegeko ngenga rigena ibikurikizwa mu bikorwa bya Guverinoma. Hari n’ibindi byavuguruwe mu mikorere kandi twishimira n’ubundi abandi bazakomeza kubakiraho.

Ntabwo mvuga ngo twarabirangije, ariko n’abandi bazahera kuri ibyo bareba bati ese birahagije? Hari ikindi gishobora gukorwa kirenzeho, ariko hari ibyatangiye kandi ndibaza ko n’abandi bashobora gukomerezaho.

Haba hari nk’ingero z’ibyavuguruwe mu rwego rw’imikorere y’umutwe w’Abadepite?

Ni byinshi cyane byavuguruwe, ariko wenda icyo navuga twongeyemo ingufu cyane ni uburyo bwo kugenzura ibikorwa bya Guverinoma.

Nk’igihe abadepite bamaze gutora ingengo y’imari ya Leta, bakajya kureba hakiri kare niba hari ibikorwa byagenewe iyo ngengo y’imari hakarebwa uko bishyirwa mu bikorwa.

Hakarebwa ese niba hari umushinga wagombaga gukorwa, watangiriye ku gihe? Ese inyigo zagombaga gukorwa, zarakozwe uko zikwiye ku buryo zisubiza ikibazo?

Hari byinshi byagiye bikorwa ariko cyane mu kugenzura ibintu hakiri kare, tutari twabona za raporo z’umugenzuzi mukuru w’imari ya Leta, kugira ngo ibigomba gukosorwa bikosorwe hakiri kare amazi atari yarenga inkombe cyangwa ibintu bitari byaba bibi.

Haba hari ubutumwa mwifuza kugeza ku Banyarwanda?

Ndongera gushimira Abanyarwanda batugiriye icyizere bakadutora, kandi nkakomeza nanone kubasaba ko bagira uruhare mu bikorwa by’Inteko Ishinga Amategeko ku badepite bitoreye, buriya bagira uruhare mu bikorwa by’iterambere.

N’imishinga y’amategeko isuzumirwa mu Nteko, abumva babishoboye batange ibitekerezo byakirwe kugira ngo ibyo bakora byose bibe bikozwe mu buryo bunoze kurushaho kandi bugizwemo uruhare n’Abanyarwanda.

Ndanabasaba ko gahunda za Leta zose zigamije iterambere ry’igihugu cyacu bazigiramo uruhare, ibitekerezo n’uruhare rwabo birakenewe kugira ngo n’igihugu cyacu kibashe kwihuta mu iterambere tubashe kugera kuri byinshi byiza twifuza kandi twifuriza Abanyarwanda.

Muri manda ishize y’Umutwe w’Abadepite hasuzumwe hanatorwa amategeko agera kuri 392, harimo Itegeko Nshinga rya Repubulika y’u Rwanda, amategeko Ngenga 10 n’amategeko asanzwe 381.

Ku bindi bibazo byasabaga ko Umutwe w’Abadepite uhamagaza abagize Guverinoma babishinzwe kugira ngo babisobanure banasabwe kubikosora, Umutwe w’Abadepite warakiriye ibisobanuro mu nyandiko cyangwa mu magambo inshuro 32.

Mukabalisa Donatille yavuze ko muri manda ishize ibyo bateganyaga babigezeho ku kigero gishimishije

Umutwe w'Abadepite washeshwe kuri uyu wa 14 Kamena 2024