Apôtre Gitwaza yahishuye byinshi: Ubuhanuzi, amadini, ikiganiro gikomeye n’intumwa ya Papa n’ibindi (Video)

Yanditswe na Philbert Girinema
Kuya 31 Nyakanga 2019 saa 03:09
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Umushumba w’Itorero Zion Temple, Apôtre Dr Paul Gitwaza, yahishuye uburyo intumwa ya Papa Yohani Pawulo II, yagiye kumuganiriza, imubaza ibibazo birenga 120 bigaruka ku buryo abayoboke ba Kiliziya Gatolika bari bari kujya mu itorero rye ku bwinshi.

Gitwaza yabigarutseho mu kiganiro cyihariye yagiranye na IGIHE, cyagarutse ku ngingo zitandukanye yaba ku buzima bwe bwite, ibijyanye n’ubuhanuzi yagiye avugwaho, ibikorwa bya Zion Temple n’ibindi.

- Yagarutse ku byo Imana yamweretse iterambere rya Nyarutarama, Ikibuga cy’Indege cya Bugesera,…

- Uburyo hari umuntu washatse kumugirira nabi amuziza umugore wakijijwe

- Ibyo kuba yaravuze ko ariwe muhanuzi wa mbere mu Rwanda

- Ibyo yibaza kuri Perezida Kagame

- Uko yatangiye ivugabutumwa mu Rwanda n’ibindi

Ikiganiro kirambuye Gitwaza yagiranye na IGIHE

IGIHE: Kugira ngo Gitwaza abe umuvugabutumwa twese tuzi byaje gute?

Gitwaza: Navukiye mu nzu y’umupasiteri, data yabaye umupasiteri wa mbere wakiriye ubutumwa Imana imuhamagaye mu ishyamba amara imyaka ibiri Imana imuhamagara atazi uwo ariwe, umuntu aza kumurangira abazungu b’abamisiyoneri b’abanya- Suède ko bashobora kumusobanurira ibyo bintu, yari yagiye no mu bapfumu kuraguza bamubwira ko ibyo bibarenze.

Ijwi rikamusanga buri munsi aragiye, ari umushumba kandi aryamye no mu nzozi. Rimubuza amahoro, rikamubwira mu izina rye rwose ngo uzaragira bene wanyu, ajya kureba abamisiyoneri b’abazungu, amaze kubabona bamubwira ibya Yesu, aravuga ati ‘uyu Yesu ndashaka kumubona kuko amaze imyaka ibiri ambuza amahoro’ bati oya araza mu mutima wawe.

Amwakiriye yambwiye ko yagize amahoro. Data yabatijwe mu 1945. Ari mu bantu batangije itorero rya Pantekote mu Repubulika Iharanira Demokarasi ya Congo.

Aho niho navukiye, ntabwo nagiye mu gipasiteri kuko nasengewe kuko nakuriyemo, nonse amashereka y’igipasiteri. Nagiye mu bindi ariko umuhamagaro wanjye ari uw’igipasiteri.

Kuza mu Rwanda rero bwari ubwa mbere abantu bambonye ariko ahandi bari banzi, nko muri Congo no muri Kenya bari banzi cyane, natangiye kuvuga ubutumwa mfite imyaka 14 none uyu munsi mfite imyaka isaga 30 nkora ivugabutumwa.

IGIHE: Ku myaka 14, wari umaze neza gucengerwa n’ijambo ry’Imana?

Gitwaza: Nibwo bwa mbere nigishije ijambo ry’Imana mu ruhame rw’abantu, kandi abasaza bari aho barabikunda cyane kuva uwo munsi ntangira kwigisha.

Kuva ku myaka icyenda nibwo nabatijwe, ku wa 12 mbatizwa mu mazi menshi. Ku mwaka wa 13 nuzura umwuka wera ntangira kuvuga izindi ndimi, mpanurira abantu bari aho bagira ubwoba nanjye ndabugira ndavuga nti ese ibi ni ibiki? Ku myaka 14 nibwo natangiye noneho kuvuga ubutumwa.

Apôtre Dr. Gitwaza Paul ni umwe mu bavugabutumwa bamaze kwandika izina rikomeye mu mitima ya benshi mu Rwanda

IGIHE: Ikibwirizwa watanze bwa mbere cyavugaga kuki ?

Gitwaza: Uwo munsi nasomye ijambo rivuga ngo Yohana Umubatiza ari mu nzu y’imbohe atuma abigishwa kujya kubaza Yesu ngo ese ni wowe cyangwa si wowe ?

Atangira gushidikanya uwo yahamije ngo uyu niwe naje gusimbura, anabwira abigishwa ngo dore uriya niwe uzikorera ibyaha by’abantu, arangije ari mu bibazo aravuga ati mujye kumumbariza niba ariwe kuko yatekerezaga ko koko niba ari Yesu aramufunguza.

IGIHE: Kuki ariryo wahisemo?

Gitwaza: Ryanjemo. Barambwiye ngo ntegure ijambo ndasoma numva ariryo rinzamo kandi nkumva ndarikunze cyane kuko hari abantu bari aho bakunze Imana ariko ibibazo byaza bakarira bakavuza induru batekerezaga ko Imana yabataye.

Ndababwira nti ariko se iyo mwizeye kuki mwongera gushidikanya? Nibwo bwari ubutumwa bwanjye bukomeye kuko njye nkunda kwizera.

IGIHE: Ni ikihe kintu kimwe gikomeye ubona ukesha kwizera kwawe?

Gitwaza: No gutangira Zion Temple ni ukwizera. Navukiye ahantu hitwa Uvira nkurira mu misozi y’i Milenge ahitwa Bijombo aho mu Bijombo ikintu cyonyine nari nzi ni indege ica hejuru; imodoka si nari nyiza, igare si nari ndizi, amashanyarazi si nari nyazi, nta kintu na kimwe nari nzi.

Nahavuye mfite imyaka 18, muri iyo myaka nagiye Kisangani, njya Nairobi mpava nza mu Rwanda mva mu Rwanda njya muri Australie, muri Leta Zunze Ubumwe za Amerika; ibyo byose ni ukwizera. Aho ngera hose usanga abantu bose banyubaha ariko nakwibuka aho navuye nkaseka.

IGIHE: Umunsi wa mbere winjiye hano mu Rwanda kwigisha, byari bimeze bite ?

Gitwaza: Nahaje ntafite igiceri na kimwe mu mufuka, nari mvuye Nairobi mfite ibihumbi bibiri by’amashilingi, bus ingeza Kampala muri Uganda izaza i Kigali sinari mfite amafaranga ya hotel.

Muri iyo bus niho naraye, nirirwamo ngenda nk’ejo. Ndaza ngera kuri gare yahoze kwa Rubangura kera icyo gihe, ntazi iyo njya ntazi umuntu n’umwe mu Rwanda, uretse umugore w’umupfakazi wari uhunze bamaze kwica umugabo we n’abana ansanga muri Kenya arankunda aramenya ansigira agakarita ke.

Ndavuga nti ese wa mu mudamu yaba yaragarutse, njya ku dukiyosike twari duhari, ndamuhamagara. Nta mafaranga nari mfite, ndavuga nti ese ni ntelefona uyu mugore nkamubona ndishyura iki ? Mfata telefoni sinari mfite n’igiceri mu mufuka, ndamuhamagara [ni rwa rugendo rwo kwizera] ndatelefona ngize Imana aranyitaba.

Arambwira ati ni Gitwaza ? ati uri he? Nti ndi muri gare, ati tegereza ndaje. Noneho mbwira wa muhungu nti nta mafaranga mfite, ngira ngo yari amafaranga nka 20 gutyo, arambwira ati ndakubabariye igendere. Wa mugore araza anjyana iwe ndagenda mpamara amezi atandatu nibwo natangiye kuvuga ubutumwa.

IGIHE: Utangira kubwiriza mu Rwanda abantu babyakiriye bate ?

Gitwaza: Byarabatangaje cyane kuko ndabyibuka bwa mbere mbwiriza nabikoreye muri Restauration Church Kimisagara, mbabwiriza hejuru yo kwiyiriza ngo dusabire igihugu, mpavuye abantu bamwe barankunda, bambwira ko najya kwigisha ku Inkuru Nziza njyayo ndahabwiriza ijambo rivuga ngo abitiriwe izina ryanjye nibaca bugufi bagasenga nzabumva ndi mu ijuru mbakirize igihugu.

Njya muri Kaminuza y’i Butare icyo gihe njya kuvugayo ubutumwa, nzenguruka u Rwanda kuko ahantu ha mbere Imana yari yaranyeretse nkiri muri Kenya ni mu Bugesera, imbwira ibintu izakorayo ko hazaba ikibuga gikomeye, ko hariya habaye amarira kuva kera azibagurana kandi kikazaba ari igihugu kirumbuka cyera cyane, Bugesera nyijyamo ndayizenguruka hose mbabwira iby’Imana yambwiye izahakora. U Rwanda rwose ndaruzenguruka mu ivugabutumwa.

IGIHE: Hari umuntu ushobora kumva bi bintu akavuga ati uyu muntu arabeshya!

Gitwaza: Na ba Thomas babanye na Yesu. Yesu yaravuze ati nazutse Thomas ati ntarabona inkovu ze n’ibiki sinzemera kandi ari umwe yari yarabwiye ngo nzazuka, ibaze noneho utemera Imana.

Uwo icyo umuntu akora amushakira umwanya bakaganira akamushakira ibimenyetso bifatika kandi nabyo turabifite.

IGIHE: Icyo gihe ubwiriza bwa mbere mu Rwanda hari mu wuhe mwaka ?

Gitwaza: Nageze mu Rwanda ku wa 1 Ukwakira 1995. Natangiye kubwiriza nyuma y’iminsi 40 nafashe y’amasengesho.

IGIHE: Umurimo wari umeze ute ku mukozi w’Imana wari uje mu gihugu kivuye muri Jenoside ?

Gitwaza: Byari bikomeye cyane. Ndatanga urugero rw’i Butare. Nagiye kwigishayo ngezeyo icyo gihe nari kumwe n’umugore wanjye yari akiri umukobwa, kuko we twamenyanye tuba muri Congo ariko iwabo hari inaha, yaje mbere ho gato ko Jenoside iba, nje nsanga yacitse ku icumu niwe wamfashaga.

Njya kwigisha i Butare, Lecteur wari uriho icyo gihe yanga ko ninjiramo, arambwira ati mwiciye abanyeshuri hano none urashaka kwicisha abandi ? Ndamubwira nti ariko si ndi umwicanyi, hari ubutumwa Imana yampaye ndi muri Kenya ngo mbuzanire abanyeshuri ba hano.

Arambwira ngo Imana? Genda wowe niyo Mana mumvire aha, aranyirukana. Nafashijwe n’umupadiri witwa Guillaume yari nyirarume w’umugore wanjye, umugore wanjye yagiyeyo ati fiancé wanjye yabuze aho abwiriza, iruhande rwa kaminuza hari kiliziya nto asiga ayiduhaye arahunga yigira i Nyanza, kuko nari umupantekote ngiye kubwiririza ubutumwa mu kiliziya, ntibyari byoroshye.

Hari abatubwiraga bati ese wowe utandukaniye he n’abandi, ni iki kitwemeza ko uri umunyakuri ariko icyaje kubemeza ni ibitangaza n’ibimenyetso.

Apôtre Gitwaza yavuze ko byari bigoye kubwiriza mu Rwanda rwari ruvuye muri Jenoside yakorewe Abatutsi

IGIHE: Nyuma yaho nibwo watangije Zion Temple ngira ngo ?

Gitwaza: Yatangiye mu 1999, ku itariki 11 Nyakanga. Tuyitangira turi abantu 120, ariko mbere y’uko itangira twafashe imyaka itatu cyangwa ine dusenga, ariko nako nzenguruka mu bice bitandukanye by’igihugu nshyiraho ibicaniro by’amasengesho noneho Imana iza kumbwira kuyubakira umusozi.

IGIHE: Ni irihe banga mwakoresheje kugira ngo Zion Temple igire abayoboke benshi nk’abo ifite ubu?

Gitwaza: Ni igihe cyari kigeze. Imitima y’abantu icyo gihe yari iri mu mayira abiri, ishakisha ndahita he ndafata he? Kuko muri kamere y’Abanyarwanda bemera Imana kandi barashaka Imana rero hari ukuntu imitima yabo yashakishaga.

Ikindi igihe cyatumye ijambo Zion ribaho. Ikindi ni amasengesho, yego n’abandi barasenga kandi barasengaga ariko uburyo twasengaga kwari ukwitangira umuntu ukanamupfira.

Ndibuka ko najyaga nsengera abantu bahungabanye kuva saa tatu za mu gitondo nkageza saa cyenda z’ijoro, maze ukwezi kumwe ndongoye. Maze hafi amezi atatu ntabana n’umugore, ndara nsengera abantu bukira bugacya.

Kuba abo bantu narabitagaho cyane byarabakuruye, ikindi ni ibisubizo. Iyo usengeye umuntu akabona birabaye abwira undi. Ikindi ni ubutumwa bujyanye n’igihe turimo. Ukabwiriza ariko warangiza ukavana rya jambo mu gitabo ukarihuza n’ubuzima bw’abantu.

IGIHE: Uyu munsi Zion Temple ifite abayoboke bangahe?

Gitwaza: Hariya dusengera mu Gatenga dufite abayoboke ibihumbi 15. Tugira amateraniro atatu. Mu ntara n’ahandi naho turahari ariko ndatekereza ko tutari benshi cyane mu Rwanda ni nk’ibihumbi 40. Ku Isi yose twaba tugeze nko kuri miliyoni.

IGIHE: Muri iki gihe hari ubwiyongere bw’amadini, biteza abantu urujijo mu mahitamo aboneye, mubona atari ikibazo?

Gitwaza: Ntabwo ari ikibazo kugira amadini menshi, ikibazo ni ukugira abayobesha benshi, ugiye ugira idini ririmo inyigisho nzima si ikibazo.

Ushobora kuza iwanjye mu Gatenga ariko wabura lisansi ukajya ahakwegereye bikagufasha. Ikibazo twaba dufite ni ukugira amadini y’ubuyobe, ariko abaye menshi yigisha ibyiza byo si ikibazo rwose.

IGIHE: Muri iki gihe hari ubwiyongere bw’amadini, ubona ari ayahe mahitamo abakirisitu bakwiye gukurikiza?

Gitwaza: Ni ugukirikiza umutima wawe. Umutima nama burya Imana ivugiramo, icya kabiri ni ukujya ahantu basoma bibiliya bakayisobanura, icya gatatu ni ukigisha inama noneho ukamenya neza.

Ikindi wamenyera ku itorero wasengeramo ry’ukuri ni irigufasha, rikwitaho, rikwereka urukundo, rigukuza mu mpano zawe; rikuzamura rikakuremera ibitekerezo.

IGIHE: Hari ibintu byinshi byavuzwe kuri Zion Temple, bajya bavuga ko ngo mugitangira Zion Temple yagize abayoboke benshi Kiliziya Gatolika ikagira ikibazo ndetse i Vatican bakabahamagara babaza kuri Zion Temple nibyo?

Gitwaza: Ibyo abantu bavuga byo ni byinshi ariko njye icyo nzi ni uko nigeze kuganira n’umugabo wari intumwa ya Papa, ntiyari aje kuganira nko kunyiyama yari aje kumbaza uko tubigenza, ati kuki abantu barimo kuva muri Kiliziya Gatolika baza iwanyu? Byari ibibazo byinshi bigera ku 120, yari intumwa ya Papa Pawulo wa II turaganira cyane kandi icyanejeje ni uko naje kubona bimwe mu byo twaganiriye bikorwa muri Kiliziya Gatolika.

IGIHE: Ibyo ni nk’ibiki?

Gitwaza: Nko kubyina. Amatorero ya kera afite uburyo yaririmbaga, yacurangaga, bitandukanye n’ubu usanga urubyiruko ruririmba mu bundi buryo nk’ibyo byose ni ibirimo biza ubu bitari biriho.

Ntekereza ko uwo mupadiri wandebye wenda hari n’abandi yarebye ariko baba barakuyemo ko hari ibyo tugomba guhindura bijyanye n’iki gihe.

Ntiwakomeza gukoresha injyana za kera nka orgue kandi ubu haraje za Hip Hop… biriya byose urumva ko bari kugenda bisanisha n’Isi turimo kandi ni byiza, ikindi nk’ikintu cy’abakarisimatike ni cyiza.

Twari abapantekote bavuga mu ndimi, basengera abarwayi ariko no muri Gatolika ubu barasengera abarwayi urabona ko hari impinduka. Hari umupadiri witwa Ubald, asengera abantu, akora biriya nk’ibyo natwe dukora.

Papa Yohani Pawulo wa II yohereje intumwa kuri Gitwaza, ngo imubaze ibanga Zion Temple ikoresha ngo ibone abakirisitu benshi bavuye muri Kiliziya Gatolika

IGIHE: Hari ubuhanuzi bwinshi buvugwa, abantu bavuga ngo wahanuye ibi biraba, hari nk’ikintu wavuga ngo nakibwiwe n’Imana nkibwira abakirisitu none dore nk’iki cyarasohoye?

Gitwaza: Reka mbanze mvuge ibyo bambeshyeye ntavuze. Barambeshyeye ngo nahanuye kurangira ku Isi, mvuga igihe izarangirira ntiyarangira. Ibyo barambeshyeye. Njye navuze ibimenyetso bigaragaza imperuka, kuko na Yesu Kirisito yaravuze ngo ntazi isaha n’igihe ni se ubizi.

Muri ibyo bimenyetso navugaga guhinduka ku izuba, ko ryagombaga guhinduka amaraso, mbabwira igihe bizabera byahanuwe muri bibiliya na Yoweli, ibyo rero byarabaye.

Mbabwira na none kongera kubaho kwa Isiraheli nk’igihugu, Yesu yarabivuze ngo nimubona umutini urongeye umeze amababi kuko yigeze kuwuvuma, aravuga ngo nimubona wongeye gushibuka muzamenye ko ndi ku irembo, kandi umutini yavugaga yari Isiraheli.

Ibyo nabashije kuvugaho harimo Ikibuga cy’Indege cya Bugesera ndagenda mpashinga n’ibuye mu 1996 hariya neza barimo basiza, njyana n’abantu mpashinga ibuye.

Kubakwa kwa Nyarutarama narabivuze, hari ikigunda mu 1995 mpagera. Harimo n’imirambo, ndahasengera mbwira n’abantu nti muze mufate ibibanza hano bizahenda, ubu nanjye ubwanjye wabivuze sinahagura inzu, sinayibona.

Ikindi nababwiye ni umuhanda wa Kibuye, wari urimo ibitaka bibi cyane harimo n’abacengezi ndagenda mfata itsinda ry’abantu tuwujyamo n’amabuye, menamo amazi ndavuga nti uku mennyemo amazi uzabemo kaburimbo, nyuma y’amezi make guverinoma yahise ishyiramo kaburimbo.

Navuze no ku gukomera k’u Rwanda, nkigera muri iki gihugu bwa mbere nzenguruka naravuze nti iriya misozi mureba izaturukamo amabuye y’agaciro hari n’undi musozi ntegereje aha hafi cyane. Icyo gihe umupagani witwaga Simba Manasse wapfuye yaraje ati ‘wanyeretse uwo musozi, narawumweretse akuramo amabuye y’agaciro menshi cyane’.

Ibyo ni ibintu abankurikira bo bazi ariko ku bavuga ibyabo ni ibyabo, simvuga ngo ndi umuhanuzi, ndi igitangaza ahubwo ni ibyo Imana yari yarambwiye izakorera igihugu ntabwo ari ibyanjye, ntabwo ari ibyo nahimbye.

Yavuze ko izakigira neza, izakizamura, izagikomeza kandi izakigira ishimwe muri Afurika aba ari naho mpera ntangiza Afurica Haguruka kuko yarambwiye ngo numara gukora ibi n’ibi uzatangize iki giterane kuko bizahera aha mu Rwanda.

Hari n’ibyo navuze by’isoko rya Afurika rimwe, ibyo nabivuze kenshi n’ubwo abantu bavuga ngo wenda ni ibitabo nasomye, navuze ibyogajuru bizazamuka, imodoka zizakorerwa muri ibi bihugu zivuye hanze, mvuga n’umuhanda uzava Cairo ukagera Capetown n’undi uzava Mombasa ukagera muri Gabon; ibyo nabivuze kera cyane ntaho nari narabisomye sinzi naho nakura ibitabo birimo ibyo.

IGIHE: Hari ugutenguhwa wagiye ubona ku madini?

Gitwaza: Navukiye mu matorero mpora ntenguhwa buri munsi, kandi mpora nayavuyemo ariko nkayasubiramo, bibaho cyane.

IGIHE: Hari ikintu wibuka ukavuga uti iki cyaranshegeshe?

Gitwaza: Ni byinshi cyane. Hari nk’abana nareze bakurira ku birenge byanjye, nkabigisha, nkabasengera bakaba abashumba, nkabashyingira abandi nkababera byose; mu gitondo kimwe akakugambanira.

Ntacyo mupfuye ari no mu itorero ukabona gusa arakwandikiye agakwiza Isi yose; nk’uwo muntu aragutangaza, wanamuhamagara akabura icyo akubwira ngo urabona, akakubwira ibintu bitari byo bikagutangaza.

IGIHE: Hari Umupasiteri wabaye muri Zion Temple, ubu yashinze itorero rye ariko mu buhamye bwe avuga ko yahuye n’ibihe bikomeye mu itorero ryanyu.

Gitwaza: Biratangaje! Sinzi uwo ariwe neza ariko ashobora kuba yarahuye na ba bantu navugaga bo mu itorero ariko atari itorero. Zion Temple nta kibazo ifite ariko wenda hari abantu bayirimo bashobora kuba baramukomerekeje cyangwa se ari ku giti cyanjye nk’umuyobozi wa Zion Temple wamukomerekeje.

Icyo gihe yaba amvugira ubusa kereka yaraje tukaganira nkamwima icyo asaba ariko niba yaraje tukaganira nkamunaniza ndatekereza ko atabicisha mu itangazamakuru ahubwo yakongera kunshaka.

IGIHE: Leta iherutse kuvuga ko abanyamadini bakwiye kwiga tewolojiya, ni mu gihe tuzi ko uyu murimo ari umuhamagaro. Ntabwo mubibonamo ikibazo?

Gitwaza: Harimo ibisubizo bibiri. Igisubizo cya mbere umurimo ni umuhamagaro ariko mu muhamagaro habamo guhugurwa. Uba ufite umuhamagaro ariko ukeneye guhugurwa.

Hari abana bavuka bazi gukina umupira hari n’abandi babyiga mu ishuri. Wa wundi wavutse azi kuwukina uri mu maraso, iyo abonye noneho ishuri, abikora neza, wa wundi utabifite mu maraso urabibona ko arimo asunikiriza.

Hari abapasiteri, abakozi b’Imana ubona barahamagawe, abo bagize ikindi kibahugura baba beza cyane. Hari abandi ubona bahuguwe ariko bahatiriza. Ukumva arigisha ubwenge, ibyo yize ariko arahatiriza. Uwo we birashoboka ko ari amashuri yagiyemo ariko atari umuhamagaro, wenda yakora ikindi cyiza cyane yahamagariwe gukora.

Leta kuba yaravuze ibyo ntiyabivuze nabi. Ni ukuri abantu bagomba guhugurwa. Kuko n’umuganga ntiwapfa gufata icyuma ngo ubage umuntu utarabyigiye.

IGIHE: Amadini agira uruhare mu gufasha leta mu bikorwa by’iterambere, tugiye mu bintu bifatika watubwira umusanzu wa Zion Temple mu Rwanda?

Gitwaza: Ibitagaragara ni imitima y’abantu twasannye, kandi umuntu kumusanira umutima uba umuhaye byose. Icyo ni ikintu kitagaragara abantu badashobora gupima ariko Zion Temple n’andi matorero byakoze, mu gusana, mu kuzana ubwiyunge muri iki gihugu.

Ibigaragara, dufite amavuriro, nk’ivuriro rya Kicukiro dukorana n’Akarere ka Kicukiro. Dufite ivuriro hariya rikomeye cyane Zion Temple itera inkunga, igafasha n’abakozi baho, agace dutuyemo ka Gatenga hari n’ubwo aba Gikondo bazaga ugasanga abarwayi babaye benshi, iyo ni Zion Temple ibifasha, igatanga na mituweli ku miryango idashobora kwishyura ibitaro.

Ikindi Zion Temple ikora ni uburezi. Ifite amashuri hirya no hino mu Rwanda. Dufite n’abandi bana twishyurira mu ntara zitandukanye icyo ni ikintu gikomeye Zion Temple ikora. Twe gusa ntituzi gusakuza ngo tuvuge ariko turashaka ngo ibikorwa byonyine byivugire.

Dufite amakoperative afasha abaturage kwibeshaho, gucuruza, imishinga y’inkoko, ibyo ni ibintu dukora hirya no hino.

Hari nk’uriya mudugugu wa Mandela, Zion n’inshuti zabo babashije kuwushyiramo umuriro n’amazi. Ni byinshi.

IGIHE: Mwigeze kuvuga ko Zion Temple ishaka gushinga ikigo cy’imari, byo bihagaze bite?

Gitwaza: Uwo mushinga uracyahari. Twashatse gushyiraho icyo kigega cy’imari [Microfinance] tumaze no gushyiraho amafaranga byose, nyuma hazamo utubazo, urabona hari ibyo twagombaga kuzuza, amategeko ya BNR, ariko uwo mushinga uracyahari uri muri gahunda, hari n’abagifite imigabane yabo, mu minsi iri imbere dushobora gukomeza icyo kigo.

IGIHE: Wigeze kwigisha abakirisitu kutagira ubwoba, ubaha urugero rw’umuntu wigeze kugufatiraho imbunda. Byagenze gute?

Gitwaza: Hari kera cyane! Nka za 2000. Twari tumanutse mu modoka, tubona indi ije yiruka cyane, mbwira shoferi nti ‘parika hariya gato tumureke atambuke’ kuri Rwandex.

Araza amparika iruhande, ati ‘wowe Gitwaza nakwica’. Mvuyemo nkuyemo umukandara muhaye umutwe nti ‘ndasa’, abonye bikomeye aratinya, ndamwinjirana imbunda [pistolet] ayita hasi. Nshaka kugatora aragakandagira noneho mufata mu ijosi ndamubwira nti ‘oya sohoka unyice’.

Ariko nyuma naje kumenya impamvu. Hari umudamu yakurikiraga wari wakirijwe muri Zion, wa mudamu ntiyaba akimukunze, noneho aravuga ngo Gitwaza nzamwica kuko ni we watumye unyanga.

Nagiye mu rusengero uwo mugoroba ndabivuga nyuma y’igihe nk’ukwezi wa mudamu aza kundeba ati ‘umbabarire, si njye ariko umuntu twakundanye, naramwanze kuko afite umugore we, njye nari nk’ihabara rye ariko maze kumva ubutumwa bwawe kuri radiyo ndakizwa, ndamusezera’. Arambwira ati ‘ese ugiye he?’ ndamubwira nti ‘nsengera muri Zion’ arambwira ati ‘Gitwaza nzamwica’. Ni uko yashakaga kunyicira umugore wikirijwe. Ni icyo nari ngiye kuzira.

IGIHE: Hari ibutumwa bwatambutse buvuga ko ari wowe muhanuzi wa mbere mu Rwanda, bwakuruye impaka cyane. Mubivugaho iki?

Gitwaza: Nk’ubu navuga ngo ndi umukanishi wa mbere mu Rwanda, umuganga akavuga ngo urambabaje? Igitangaje ni uko ababihagurukije si n’abahanuzi, si n’abapasiteri ariko ugasanga bataye umutwe.

Muri make, ni kwa kundi nyine Gitwaza ameze nk’ikibuye ukubita mu mazi agashibuka. Gitwaza ni ikibuye cyamanutse mu mitima y’abanyarwanda. Ibibarimo bijya hejuru. Benshi babuze aho bambonera bagenda bashakisha akantu ako ari kose.

Ntiwumvise uwo mugabo nkubwiye wari ugiye kunyica, ngo ihabara ye yakijijwe? Ubwo abataranyishe rero nibo banyica muri ayo magambo. Ubwo ni benshi wenda hari andi mahabara yabasize yabona ako kantu akabona icyo avugiraho.

Abakirisitu bahuye n’ibibazo bikomeye hirya no hino. Bajya hariya abantu bakabambura ngo mpa iyo modoka yawe, mpa inzu yawe kandi urimo umwenda wa banki, yajya hariya ati ‘ndagira ngo nguhunurire’ tujye gusenga mu ishyamba akamuhumanuza shitani ibintu nk’ibyo. Abantu wajya kubasengera yakubwira ubuzima bikagutangaza.

Abandi bakajya mu misozi Tanzania, za Kampala bakahahurira n’abandi nkabo, aho niho nababwiye nti ‘ese muba mushaka iki, abo bahanuzi mushaka ni nde muhanuzi ubaruta?’ njye ndi so, ni njye muhanuzi, hano mu Rwanda nta wundi muhanuzi atari njye. Muri Afurika nta wundi muhanuzi atari njye, aho mushaka ndahari.

Ni nk’uko wabwira umwana wawe uryagaguza hirya no hino uti ‘wa mwana we ni njye so bariya bandi bose baragushuka si ba so ni njye so’.

Ni ubwo buryo nababwiragamo nk’inama yo kutajarajara, bakaza bakubiswe, bambuwe, bagize kandi ndi umubyeyi wabo; birambabaza.

Niyo mpamvu nabwiye nti ‘erega nta wundi ,muhanuzi unduta, nta wundi mubyeyi unduta haba mu Rwanda haba aho muri Afurika mujya ni njye kuko ni njye ubareba, ubashinzwe. Bahita babiterura ba bandi batwawe amahabara noneho baramvuga.

Apôtre Gitwaza yanenzwe bikomeye ku mvugo ivuga ko ariwe muvugabutumwa wa mbere mu Rwanda

IGIHE: Umufasha wawe mwamenyanye mute?

Gitwaza: Umufasha wanjye twamenyanye turi abanyeshuri muri Congo ariko ni uw’aha mu Rwanda. Kuko we yaje mu biruhuko yaratashye hano mu Rwanda, ni naho Jenoside yamusanze.

Njye naje rero mu Rwanda nta wundi muntu unzi, uretse wa mupfakazi wancumbikiye nawe sinari nziko ariho ari mu barokotse bake cyane.

Ndamubona ni uko dutangira kujyana mu ivugabutumwa kuko niwe wari uzi u Rwanda yari afite na mudasobwa akanyandikira ibyo nshaka gukora, turajyana za Kibungo n’ahandi biza kuvamo ko mukunda ariko mbere ho ntibyari mo.

IGIHE: Nta bigeragezo by’abakobwa wahuye nabyo mu busore?

Gitwaza: Sinamubengutse gutya gusa. Nyuma yo gusenga nagize igitutu cyinshi cy’abakobwa. Ngeza aha mu Rwanda nagize ibibazo by’abakobwa benshi bazaga bambwira ngo Imana yababwiye ko nzabarongora, narangiza kwigisha nkabona nk’abakobwa batanu banyikubiseho, ndavuga nti ‘nzakizwa n’iki ibi bibazo’, ndasenga aho rero muri icyo gitutu niho naje kuyoborwa ati ‘ese urarinda ujya kure, muri kumwe, ni uyu’.

IGIHE: Iyo urebye ku basore n’abakobwa muri iki gihe barambagizanya ukabihuza n’uko byari bimeze kuri wowe ubibona ute?

Gitwaza: Abana b’ubu bapfa kurongora badafite intego. Njye uwo yari yamfashije cyane no mu ivugabutumwa mbona azanashobora umurimo wanjye.

Tugikundana naramubwiye nti ‘ese ko nta kandi kazi nkora katari ivugabutumwa kandi icyo gihe hari abandi baza kumurambagiza benshi ndetse twahuriraga n’iwabo ngiye kubaramutsa ngasanga imodoka ziraparitse. Njywe naje n’amaguru, kuva Kacyiru nkajya i Nyamirambo n’amaguru, ngasanga abandi bahageze n’imodoka.

Hari umunsi namubwiye nti ‘nabonye izi modoka’, arambwira ati ‘barandambagiza ariko simbashaka’. Nti ‘None se njye wankunda?’

Arambwira ati ‘icyo nshaka si ibintu ndashaka uwo mutima w’Imana’. Uko niko twakundanye ariko nanjye mukundira ko yaramfashije cyane.

N’uyu munsi ntuzabona umugore wanjye ngo agiye mu by’ivugabutumwa, oya. Arera abana no kunyitaho kandi nawo ni umuhamagaro ukomeye.

Ni umuntu Imana yampaye, ni we unyambika, ni we umenyera byose. Namurongoye ndi umuturage we ari umwana uzi ikizungu. Anyereka uko bambara karuvati, uko bashyiramo agapantalo.

Abana b’ubu bo aragenda yareba agasura hariya akavuga ati ‘ni uyu’. Ibyumweru bitatu ukwezi, bakaba batandukanye.

Inama umuntu yababwira ni ukureba umuntu uzagushyigikira mu iyerekwa ufite. Urongora umuntu uzafasha ya ntego yawe kandi ugukunda nawe umukunda.

IGIHE: Nta bajya baza bakakubwira bati waradusezeranyije ariko byanze?

Gitwaza: Baraje mu mezi atatu baratandukanye. Bakaza nkabasezeranya mu mezi atatu ngo yagiye undi yagiye, abandi bati ‘byakomeye’. Ndetse abandi bagahunga umwe nkumva ngo ageze Canada undi ari hano.

Ibyo birababaje cyane, naranabivuze mu rusengero igihe kimwe ngiye kubashyingira. Ndababwira nti ngiye kubashyingira ariko ‘umutima urandya’. Sinshaka gushyingira abantu ejo nzumva ngo mwatanye.

Ibyo ni ibibazo dufite, bataranabyara. Nagerageje kureba nsanga ni hose atari iwacu gusa. Ni nk’ikiza gihari ubu. Cyane cyane ni kwa kurongora cyangwa kurongorwa mutaziranye cyangwa ukabana n’umugore cyangwa umugabo ugushyira mu buzima buhenze kandi nta buryo ufite cyangwa se ukamubeshya mu gihe ufite abandi iruhande. Ibyo ni byo biri mu bana b’ubu.

IGIHE: Hari n’urubyiruko usanga rufite imico itari myiza, hari abatwaye inda zitateganyijwe, kunywa ibiyobyabwenge, nka Zion Temple ni iki mubikoraho?

Gitwaza: Dufite abana benshi baje kwihana ku by’ibiyobyabwenge ariko ni ibyo guhozaho. Sinzi n’aho barukura njye byarantagaje. Abana ugira utya ukabona bari mu biyobyabwenge, dufite urubyiruko aha hanze rurapfuye.

Itorero rikwiye kongera gukora ivugabutumwa n’ubukangurambaga, cyane si itorero ni ababyeyi. Guhera umwana akiri muto ukamurera, warangiza ukamuha ishuri ni byiza ariko byakabaye byiza umureze ukamuha n’itorero hakiri kare kuko hari ibyo rimurinda hakiri kare.

Ajya muri rya shuri agasangayo abandi bana ariko n’iyo umwana yarerewe mu nzu y’Imana hakiri kare hari ibyo atinya.

Nkanjye sinigeze nywa inzoga, sinigeze nywa itabi kuko nakuriye mu nzu y’abakirisitu.

IGIHE: Ibyishimo byuzuye kuri wowe ubibona ryari?

Gitwaza: Mu by’ukuri mporana ibyishimo. Njye nkunda kwicurangira, njye mfite gitari mu rugo, ndacuranga iyo ncuraga utubazo twari tundimo tumvamo.

Na madamu wanjye arayikunda cyane. Iyo hari nk’utubazo mu rugo araza akayishyira hariya ubundi agasohoka, akambwira ati ‘ese gitari ntiwayibonye?’ arabizi gitari ni umuti.

IGIHE: Ni iki kigutera ubwoba mu buzima kurusha ibindi?

Gitwaza: Ni ukutagera ku ntego yanjye. Sinjya ntinya ngo umuntu yanyica, njya ntinya ko ntagera ku ntego yanjye Imana ikazabimbaza. Kuko yo tuzabonana burundu, ibyo yanshize gukora kuba ntarabikoze nicyo kijya kintera ubwoba.

N’amasengesho yanjye aba arimo ngo Mana uzambabarire nubona ngiye guteshuka.

IGIHE: Ni iyihe ndangagaciro wiyiziho abantu bashobora kuba batazi?

Gitwaza: Kwizera.

IGIHE : Ni nde muntu mu bari ku Isi wishimira kandi wubaha kuruta abandi?

Gitwaza : Mu idini umuntu ujya untangaza, mu mateka nasomye ni babiri. Hari uwitwa François d’Assise na Sadhu Sundar Singh. Bari abaherwe basiga byose, biyegurira Imana.

Muri politiki ntagazwa cyane na Perezida Kagame, uburyo umuntu ashobora gutegeka igihugu cyapfuye, ugahagarara ku magufa nko mu kibaya cya Ezechiel ugahanura akabaho, abantu ukabaremamo ibyiringiro bakabana.

Abantu bapfuye mu mitima, ntihabeho kwihorera, kandi bamwe bafite imbunda. Icyo ni ikintu kintangaza mu cyerekezo cya Perezida Kagame. Ari mu bayobozi bantangaza, uko ushobora gutegeka umusirikare ufite imbunda ngo ntiyihorere.

Icyerekezo, gutwara abantu imbere wabikura ku bandi ariko ubwo bubasha bwo gutuma mfite imbunda ariko ntakwica umuntu, agatinya ngo hejuru yanjye hari umuntu, icyo ni ikintu gikomeye namwubahiye. Mubonye tukaganira namubaza uko yabigenje.

IGIHE: Ntabwo murabonana?

Gitwaza: Wenda mu bindi bitari ibi, ariko yemeye ko tuganira icyo nakimubaza.

Naho mu buzima busanzwe umuntu wantangaje ni Martin Luther King. Guhaguruka mu gihe gitangaje akazana ubutumwa bw’urukundo mu bantu babanye, yarangiza akanabizira, agashyiraho urubuga rw’impirimbanyi zivugira uburenganzira bwabo, uriya mugabo yarantangaje.

Ngira ibitabo by’abantu batatu nkunda gusoma. Hari Mahatma Ghandi nkagira igitabo cya Martin Luther King nkagira n’igitabo cya Mandela.

IGIHE: Ni iyihe ndangagaciro wumva umuntu wese akwiye kugira?

Gitwaza: Indangaciro data yanyigishije ngira ni ‘ukuri’ kuko byose bishingiye ku kuri. Iyo turimo turyaryana tubeshyana ntacyo twageraho.

Urabona n’ibi nakubwiye ni ukuri, nta bintu nakubwiye ngo mfifike, mvugisha ukuri. Tubashije kugira ukuri ntacyo twapfa. Ukuri ni ikintu mparanira kandi nsengera ngo tukigire.

IGIHE: Ni irihe jambo ukunda gukoresha buri munsi?

Gitwaza: Icyubahiro. No mu masengesho sinagenda ntavuze icyubahiro cy’Imana, duhe Imana icyubahiro, Mana uhabwe icyubahiro. Icyubahiro niryo jambo rimbamo nasinziriye unkubise bati ‘vuga’ navuga nti ‘Imana ihabwe icyubahiro.’

IGIHE: Ni iki wifuzaga ukiri umwana?

Gitwaza: Njye nifuzaga kuba umupilote ariko sinabyifuje kubera ikindi. Ubupilote nabwifuje kuko nabaye mu misozi, ndavuga sinzatunga imodoka ariko izi ndege zihora zinca hejuru buri munsi, nzayitware.

IGIHE: Uretse gusenga no kuvuga ubutumwa bw’Imana ni kiki ukunda gukora?

Gitwaza: Nkunda gusoma kandi ibitabo byose. Si bibiliya, si iby’Imana. Nsoma ibitabo bitandukanye by’ubukungu, iby’ubuvuzi, bya politiki, n’iyo ndi mu ndege mfite mudasobwa nashyizemo ibitabo ibihumbi bitanu. Sindabisoma byose ariko ngenda nsoma. Nkunda na ka Siporo.

IGIHE: Ni iki wifuza ko umuntu wakumenye yazakwibukiraho utakiri ku Isi?

Gitwaza: Njye ikintu umuntu yazanyibukiraho mu buzima napfuye, ni umunezero. Nkunda ko umuntu yishima, iyo umuntu yishimye nanjye numva nezerewe.

Nasenze n’Imana ngo umunsi naryamye mu isanduku abantu bazasange harimo ibitwenge.

IGIHE: Nihe wumva ko umuntu yasoma muri Bibiliya hakamufasha muri aka kanya?

Gitwaza: Ijambo namusaba gusoma ni Abefeso 2:10.


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